#tlsnotary-chat

oh, okay, seems reasonable

i thought someone else is trying to notarize an alipay page lol

right; we only take HEAD requests so 99% of the crap is just ignored.

waxwing: so we can do 100 txs in 20 seconds? :)

not sure. we could probably do quite a lot in 20 seconds.

100 sounds too high, but i haven't got solid data. did 3 in about 5-8 seconds i think.

so get 10000 nodes we can do 50,000 tps

i don't know what the actual limitations are.

in the future everyone takes a snapshot when they make a tx

i just updated the server with new version, if you want to use it you need to do as above ^ dansmith_btc

triple-entry accounting for the win, or TEA

yeah maybe you could be constantly gathering data as a way to prove shady practices at an exchange, or something.

oakpacific: pls git pull to run new sessions

will do sometime :)

yeah, just saying that server is updated so old version won't work

computer crashed, didnt corrupt the blockchain

successkid.jpg

first time i did it, took about half a day

but yeah it handles recovery pretty well afaik

https://www.reddit.com/r/investing/comments/31f... <- interesting thread

some guy went all-in on lehman brothers and washington mutual

some people got oil

My first house in 2005. I was 23 and making decent money. Buy real estate they all said. Real Estate prices never fall, it's a sure bet. Almost ten years of payments, still not at break even.

things like lehman make sense as small bets that could grow a lot. e.g. some made a killing in GM like that.

bitcoin shows up too

although the next comment is about someone buying at $10 selling at $1150

for once buffett is right

in what?

spouse

low expectations from both sides

can't be more right

oh yeah

https://www.reddit.com/r/Bitcoin/comments/31i6o... i grabbed 15 or so reddit karma points from this

nice

a thing i can add to that thread, dont live in a country where a war happens

(the worst investment one)

that's to say, pre-1945 there is no place in the world you can safely invest

really? not even the british east india company

that was a great investment iirc

belcher: well,the dutch one was much better

it killed less people i imagine

i just went by the logic that you don't invest in a country where war happens

pre-1945 all sorts of countries were routinely in war

ah yes

well if you invest in the winning side you'll be okay

see post-war america

america wasn't rich only because it won, but also because it was remote from the theatre of war.

britain also won :)

yep true

america was rich because it was rich

the thing with war is even if you win, you dont necessarily win

it's surreal to think that the same guy who wrote RSA in three lines for t-shirts and bypassing export controls, also invented hashcash and is, today, discussing the (de)merits of proof of stake on this IRC server.

black slaves eat sausages and eggs, fried chickens and watermelons, imperial Chinese peasants, while technically free, could enjoy nothing of the sort

adam3us wrote that t-shirt ?

yes, he wrote the perl 3 liner, i'm pretty sure that was what's on the t-shirt

like 99% sure

TIL

cool

yeah its a small world

zooke talks in there too sometimes

it's a small world, indeed, that seems to belong to Dr Back.

who came up with zooke's triangle

i think waxwing''s point is how come he likes PoS somehow

oakpacific: no he doesn't, he's arguing against it.

but in a curiously naive way, as if he never thought about it before :)

oh, okay

you know what I really find hard to believe? he joined bitcointalk a few days after me, in the newbie bin :)

well i was around at his inception post

wow

this guy basically invented what bitcoin is based on, and was one of the main cypherpunks in the 90s.

he started mining

he could rank there with gmaxwell as one of the most dense writers around

i am reasonably certain that it would take someone's entire life to be able to just deduce from one sentence in one of their many posts to the next one

if they were to try that is

do you think it would've been do-able to have bitcoin's subsidy related to the number of miners?

so its more like gold, a low price means less people mine and less coins are actually created

inversely for higher price

anything based on number of users doesn't work, does it, you can't identify individuals.

instead of number of users, what about something related to difficulty?

the network cant measure users but can measure hashrate

the only one that makes sense that's been suggested is transaction volume.

but even that sounds like a recipe for disaster

which is easily fake

why wouldnt subsidy related to difficulty make sense?

yeah, well 'easily' for some values of easy.

cheaply

plus some factor where only 21m can be mined

subsidy is related to difficulty, it's a zeroth order function :)

subsidy is just related to time/block number now

so, you're imagining keeping block time constant, but reducing block size in proportion to increases in difficulty?

hmm

i dont know

i guess its not really possible

why not?

im just imagining something even more similar to a real life commodity, gold/oil/copper and so on

so like a formula subsidy = 50btc*difficulty/maxdifficulty

you know what, the flaw of PoS seems so obvious to me that I keep doubting if there is something I overlooked, otherwise why so many smart people keep supporting it?

has no upper limit

oakpacific since PoW has the flaw of being wasteful i guess

belcher: i think that's a red herring

i imagine its that, PoS is liked because PoW is disliked

belcher: that's not a flaw, that's an essential component of the design. replace 'wasted' with 'used'.

yeah i understand

iv heard the analogy of the army, the only point of an army is to defend against other armies

yeah. i forget it's Physics PhD central around here :)

how is that related :p

but i can also understand pacifists and PoSers who point out the resource use

belcher: well it's probably fanciful, but i tend to think physicists grasp the idea better than others.

and yeah the whole point is resource use

use up a resource that cant be faked

as well as armies, another interesting analogy is biological displays: like how peacocks developed their feathers.

yes

horns on stags are very wasteful :)

its a kind of tragedy of the commons, if we could all agree and trust each other we wouldnt have to bother with PoW and just have a centralized database :)

if we could trust we dont need ECDSA either

yeah

big brains in humans, according to some biologists too

i otoh thinks it's due to the lack of understanding of free market

yes, but one could also cite it as progress - the resource consumption using a hashcash approach is vastly lower than using a US army approach.

yes agreed

people keep saying that miners could become monopolies, but ffs, monopoly is like the yin of the competition's yang, only a market where monopoly is possible is truly free

also a fact is human civilization depends on ever higher energy use

Burns believes, “Energy is the ultimate currency and the ultimate commodity.”

okay maybe not "ever higher"

trying to suppress monopoly would usually give you monopoly that could perpetuate and resist changes

you could imagine a steady state, but energy is damn useful

which is exactly what PoS does

actually i remember discussing "energy as a currency" with a physicist friend back in 2007, but he (nor anyone else) wasn't interested much.

imagine a price crash and panic dump, someone controls an exchange could then accumulate all the coins of a PoS chain, then maintain his monopoly forever

oakpacific: yes that's exactly what we have today: monopolies supported by regulation.

energy as a currency

we use energy ETFs as money

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cypherpunk#Civil_... <-- ref to earlier thing

good find

links to his site with a pic http://www.cypherspace.org/rsa/

which doesn't load, curiously

btw, any idea what happened with darkwallet development?

good q. lately i noticed updated to libbitcoin only in the chan.

did they fund themselves from bitcoin, so the price drop hurt them?

well, yeah, pretty sure that was the only explicit kind of funding they had.

wonder what pablo is doing nowadays. even amir seems to rarely be around.

the main reason people are interested in darkwallet is the coinjoin and stealth addresses

though darkwallet has a far wider scope than that

BitTheCoin talking in #darkwallet came in to ask

you didn't get the memo? they just invented bitcoin https://www.reddit.com/r/Bitcoin/comments/31ib3...

lol