#coins

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      • badon
        Shine bright like a diamond.
      • Yeah.
      • Shine bright like a diamond.
      • Uh-huh.
      • Shine bright like a diamond.
      • Yeah.
      • Jeruuu
        Lol, you singing, badon?
      • badon
        Hehe.
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      • zhangxaochen
        how much money do you spend on collecting? badon
      • badon
        zhangxaochen: I made my first $1 million USD in the Chinese coins, so I have quite a lot.
      • zhangxaochen
        wow ;)
      • how to trade them? or you hold them till now?
      • badon
        Yeah, that's what I said when I first learned how much they had become worth. When I started, I only had $5000 invested into them.
      • zhangxaochen
        so you always hold the coins and seldom sell them?
      • badon
        Coins are one of the best hard asset investments you can make, but they have one really HUGE negative - they're very illiquid. If I tried to sell my whole collection, it probably take several years to get the full market values for them.
      • Right, I almost never sell.
      • I trade frequently though.
      • zhangxaochen
        do you mean 'buy' when u say 'trade'?
      • badon
        I trade my "extra" coins to dealers in exchange for coins I don't already have.
      • When I say "trade" I mean trading one of my coins for someone else's coins, without converting to currency first (USD).
      • zhangxaochen
        oh i know now
      • badon
        It's barter.
      • Doing it that way makes the liquidity problem easier to deal with.
      • The dealers love me because they don't have to sink a lot of cash into their inventory. They know what I have, and what I want, so they can always contact me if they want to do a deal.
      • Instead of their cash sitting in the coins, it's my cash. I usually hold for many years before selling, and the longer you hold, the better. IN this market, the only way you can permanently lose money is if you sell.
      • I often regret selling/trading, but I never regret buying. Once again, this is because the Chinese coin market is growing so fast. It's not normal for coin markets to be this exciting, and it won't last forever.
      • Eventually the Chinese coin market will be very expensive, and a nice investment coin will cost $30'000+ instead of $300, just like the USA coin market.
      • zhangxaochen
        when did you start your collecting career?
      • and when saying 'Chinese coin market', does that refer to a website? or somewhere else? badon
      • badon
        zhangxaochen: I wouldn't call it a "career". I get in and out of coin collecting when the money is good. Most recently, I started becoming interested in the Chinese coin market in 2006, and I decided make my first serious investments in 2008. After 2008, ALL of my cash was in the coins.
      • zhangxaochen: I specifically mean PRC coins minted 1979 to today, which we discuss often at CC forum and LBC.
      • You'll see there that we do most of our business on ebay, and the same is true for many of China's most popular dealers.
      • zhangxaochen
        we use 'taobao.com' for online shopping in mainland china ;)
      • badon
        Yes, I know.
      • IT's not as good as ebay, but for the most part, Westerners can't access Taobao, while Chinese people CAN access ebay.
      • zhangxaochen
        I think keeping coins from damage(decay or rust) is a technical work
      • badon
        It's not as good in the sense that the guarantees and protections against fraud and other problems are not as good.
      • zhangxaochen: preserving coins is easy if you buy certified ones or ones that are still in their original packaging...for most of them anyway.
      • zhangxaochen
        yes taobao is not that safe
      • badon
        zhangxaochen: It's funny that Westerners are usually ahead of the Chinese coin market, so we're able to buy the coins that later the Chinese people learn about and want to buy back from us. That's why it's a good investment. If you're in the PRC or Hong Kong or Macau (etc), it should be easy for you to buy the things Chinese people don't care about, but Westerners have identified as something important
      • that they will care about in the future.
      • zhangxaochen: Are you in the PRC?
      • zhangxaochen
        maybe... i'm not sure since i'm not a collector
      • badon, yes i am
      • badon
        zhangxaochen: If you study it a little bit, you will learn that it's smart to BECOME a collector :)
      • It's not just for fun, it's profitable and a good store of value.
      • For your heirs.
      • zhangxaochen
        i just lost 1.5% of my cash by OPEN SELL spot gold at 1229 o(╯□╰)o
      • i didn't think about coins collecting before i joined this channel, and really thx a lot badon for your tips
      • badon
        zhangxaochen: No problem, I'm glad I could help.
      • zhangxaochen
        what's the roughly yearly rate of profit of your own coins?
      • badon
        zhangxaochen: If you want to start trying to make some investments, you can ask me for advice, or even better, post on the CC forum to ask for recommendations. You'll get a lot of education for free because coin collectors love to share information.
      • zhangxaochen
        cc forum? what's the url? badon
      • badon
        zhangxaochen: It's very unpredictable. The Chinese coin market is volatile, so prices can move dramatically up and down. However, the net move is strongly upward. Right now the market is still recovering from the big pullback in 2012 to 2014, so prices are very cheap, and only just barely beginning to move up again.
      • zhangxaochen: I'll get the URL for you.
      • zhangxaochen: Here's the most recent post I have made there, just now: https://forum.coincompendium.com/index.php?topi...
      • zhangxaochen: That brass baby panda I mentioned might be a good start if you want something special to begin with, and it's not too expensive for you.
      • zhangxaochen: It's $475, but it could easily be 10 times that value within 2 to 5 years.
      • When the market is hot, 400% gains every 6 months can happen for the hottest coins.
      • The baby pandas are one of those, maybe.
      • There is a cheaper version that's not as rare, but it's still a good investment at only $66 (up from $62).
      • Those haven't gone up much yet, so there's less risk of a price drop.
      • zhangxaochen
        oh... you are the admin of that forum?
      • badon
      • zhangxaochen: Yes, I am.
      • I'm admin of the other one too.
      • zhangxaochen
        or even founder of that webiste
      • badon
        And this channel also :)
      • Yes, I'm the founder of all of them.
      • I'm very busy :)
      • My strategy is to buy the rarest coins first, so if I were you, I would buy the $475 brass panda first, and get the $66 one later. The $475 one might drop to $450, but that wouldn't scare me because I know it could easily be $1000+ in a few months.
      • Like all things, diversification is good, so I have the 30 g silver, 15 g silver, brass, and gold versions. It's a complete set of all 4 coins. I'm very lucky. The gold one just sold out today at a new record high price of $3500. That coin might be $100'000 in 10 years.
      • Maybe even more.
      • The only coins I have been able to find in the mature USA market that are precedents for the baby pandas are the "production prototypes" of the 1907 gold Saint Gaudens "high relief" and "ultra high relief". For those, the least expensive one has a mintage of 12'000+ and a lowest price of around $8000 for a badly damaged specimen.
      • The baby pandas are MUCH rarer, and MUCH cheaper. It looks like an ideal investment to me, and that's why they're selling out and increasing in value quickly.
      • Because of communist restrictions in China, the knowledge of coin collecting didn't survive, so everyone is a beginner. So, experienced Westerners like me are the ones who are usually finding the best investments before the people in China learn about them.
      • Right now, it's almost entirely Westerners buying the baby pandas.
      • Chinese people in China don't even know about them.
      • It's a secret :)
      • zhangxaochen: This was the gold one: http://rover.ebay.com/rover/1/711-53200-19255-0...
      • The seller still has one more that he's not selling yet. He told me he would let me buy it if I wanted it, but I already have one. If you wanted it, I could ask him if he would sell it to you. Maybe he will say yes.
      • zhangxaochen
        i can hardly open ebay... the css (or js?) can't be loaded properly
      • badon
        zhangxaochen: What web browser are you using?
      • zhangxaochen
        sogou explorer
      • it's not about browser ,it's network
      • badon
        Oh, can you use a regular web browser?
      • zhangxaochen
        ... it's a regular one
      • badon
        Try it with Firefox or Google Chrome. It should work then.
      • Most of the world uses Firefox or Google Chrome, or something based on them. Sogou Explorer might be based on one of them too, but I'm not sure.
      • I should research it...but not enough time for everything!
      • zhangxaochen
        i tried chrome, and of no luck
      • badon
        What happened?
      • That's very strange.
      • You're using windows?
      • zhangxaochen
        yes
      • badon
        What happened when you installed Google Chrome and tried to use that? Did it give you an error message?
      • You can get help with Firefox in #firefox.
      • zhangxaochen
        opened now, it's error about GFW, sometimes I'm blocked and sometimes ok
      • badon
        Firewall?
      • As long as you're on ebay OK, that's good enough.
      • Jeruuu
        badon are you here?
      • badon
        Yes
      • Jeruuu
        OK. Its just weird because clicking the view calendar in the CC forum logs me out of the forum
      • Brings me to the February calendar then logs me out. Clicking the March calendar logs me back in. Do I need to post this?
      • badon
        Yes, screenshot it or make a video or something if you can.
      • I'm experiencing similar weird things, and I'm not sure if it's related or not.
      • Jeruuu
        I can't make a video of it. Don't know how.
      • badon
        Me neither :)
      • Jeruuu
        Video will really show it's weirdness but since I don't know how to do that, I will just do screenshots then post
      • THanks bye
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      • tested22
        hi everyone
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