#bitcoin-wizards

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      • kanzure
        "ultraslow radio for decentralized global digital communication" https://www.mail-archive.com/kragen-tol@canonic...
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      • qpm
        tx:<Jeremy_Rand> I realize that there's probably not much practical purpose for such a thing, but would it be possible to build a MimbleWimble chain that supports Namecoin-like operations as well as the standard MW currency ops?
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      • tx:<Jeremy_Rand> The 2 obvious challenges that jump out at me are (1) making a MW tx commit to the naming data, and (2) enforcing uniqueness and immutability of the "name" field of the name operations
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      • tx:<Jeremy_Rand> My initial guess is that it's not possible, but then again I never would have guessed that MW was possible to begin with
      • tx:<Jeremy_Rand> So I dislike writing off something as impossible just because I can't imagine of a way it could be done
      • tx:<Jeremy_Rand> Expiration of names might also be a challenge, I guess
      • gmaxwell
        kanzure: some of that suffers from excessive handwave and dreaming without engineering expirence in the relevant area (something I'm often guilty of), very low bitrates at very low power suffer from decohearence. You can't accomulate 1000 seconds of CDMA data to decode your bit because the paths are not stable over those kinds of timeframes; in fact, unless all the communicating parties have pret
      • ty good atomic clocks, their _oscillators_ aren't stable enough over that kind of timeframe to usefully decode the signal.
      • qpm
        tx:<Jeremy_Rand> (of course, yes, I realize that it probably makes more sense to have Namecoin be a sidechain and MW be another sidechain, or something like that)
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      • kanzure
        gmaxwell: context http://gnusha.org/logs/2016-08-31.log near 21:43
      • gmaxwell
        kanzure: fwiw, people doing low power communications is a standard ham challenge, search string: QRP. And what you find is that the lower the power the more insane the hardware and DSP becomes, not simple 'steampunk' things like the writeup suggests. :)
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      • (for a comparison point, the highest cohearent integration time I've seen reported for GPS -- kind of a perfect case example, since the sats are straight up and the troposphere is slowly changing-- is two seconds, and except for one academic paper using an exotic ultrastable oscillator (a $10k part with a one year lead time) got 30 seconds, but I dunno if that was even reproducable. Typical integ
      • ration times for high end GPS hardware are more like 20-40ms)
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      • so
        18:19 < sipa> ultraprune is just the name of the database/storage design in bitcoin core since 0.8
      • 18:20 < sipa> it's not a commitment scheme
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      • nsh
        tl;dr on TumbleBit?
      • freenet for transactions i guess
      • --
      • Description: TumbleBit is a new anonymous payments protocol that is fully compatible with today‚Äôs Bitcoin protocol. TumbleBit allows parties to make payments through an untrusted Tumbler. No-one, not even the Tumbler, can tell which payer paid which payee during a TumbleBit epoch. TumbleBit consists of two interleaved fair-exchange protocols that prevent theft of bitcoins by cheating users or a ma
      • licious Tumbler. TumbleBit combines fast cryptographic computations (performed off the blockchain) with standard bitcoin scripting functionalities (on the blockchain) that realize smart contracts. TumbleBit was used to mix 800 input addresses to 800 output addresses on Bitcoin's blockchain.
      • --
      • (fair exchange protocols are not without gotchas: http://www.internetsociety.org/sites/default/fi... )
      • gmaxwell
        nsh: it's like a coinswap, but with the swapping parties not being able to connect their transactions.
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      • nsh nods
      • nsh wonders about attacks on RIPEMD-160
      • nsh
        good enough for GPG i guess
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      • gmaxwell
        http://www.scottaaronson.com/blog/?p=1121#comme... random OT thing, that I think sometimes explains some communications challenges explaining Bitcoin tech to people without as strong of a sciences background.
      • midnightmagic
        I really like that guy's blog.
      • nsh
        scott is awesome :)
      • nsh disagrees with all of the examples where this person purports to have learned something :)
      • midnightmagic
        lol
      • nsh
        you can make similarly 'lightning' compelling arguments in less precise contexts as long as there's a decision procedure. law has endless examples that get distilled into named points of discursive reference
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      • but computation makes proof pretty optimally compelling. an functioning exploit is the scientific process perfected
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      • gmaxwell
        yes, he's wrong about the decisive turns happening in other fields-- they do (law would be a good example)-- but they're not so common in everyday social discourse.
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      • nsh nods
      • waxwing
        nsh: i really liked the paper, they really went to the trouble of explaining it in detail. also there is code and it has been used in a test run. i'd be interested in hearing expert opinion about the puzzle-promise and puzzle-solver fair exchange stuff. it makes sense to my eyes, but there's a lot going on there.
      • nsh
        aye, it reads well to my wandbearer's eyes
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      • waxwing
        oh just scanned up you already mentioned potential gotchas.
      • FNinTak
        kanzure: for multi-Ghz part of spectrum, small fractal/ folded antennas are enough for short ranges
      • Should be doable as relatively non-invasive implants or possibly self-unfolding injectables
      • though effective distance would be limited by directionality + broadcast power if the transceiver is also embedded vs. external
      • nsh
        -> ##hplusroadmap
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